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P:  4/7/2006 12:33:02 PM
Joe Pierron

Member

Total Posts: 7
Last Post: 5/9/2006
Member Since: 4/4/2006

Do property adjusters do any of the initial calls to restorers these days?; what do you look for in a restoration company?

 


Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  4/7/2006 12:33:02 PM   |   IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post


 There are 11 replies to this message.  There are 11 replies on this page.

P: 4/22/2006 10:31:15 PM
ebrooks

Member

Total Posts: 145
Last Post: 11/5/2007
Member Since: 3/18/2006

By restoration I think you mean clean up, as opposed to repair.

What percentage of your jobs involve meeting the adjuster? Do you arrive at an agreed cost with the adjuster at that point? Is the work usually completed when you do? What books etc. do you use to reach agreement on unit costs?
 
Do agents negotiate agreed costs with you?
 
What role does the insured play? Does he authorize the work? Agree to a figure? Or a scope?
 
Does the agent agree to a scope? Do you write a scope, and if you do, who do you give it to?
 
Do you give a unit cost sheet to anyone?
 
EB

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  4/22/2006 10:31:15 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 5/9/2006 2:30:48 PM
Joe Pierron

Member

Total Posts: 7
Last Post: 5/9/2006
Member Since: 4/4/2006

EB
Yes, I am speaking of clean up, or mitigation.  I have the homeowner sign the work authorization and give them an estimate at that time, if requested.  I usually give a range, depending on how many days it takes to dry.  I don't always speak with the adjuster.  The agent is rarely involved, except initially through the homeowner.  There hasn't been questioning of my pricing using xactimate from any companies except SF.  I hand the final bill to the homeowner and send it to the insurance company in the manner they request.
  Do adjusters ever hire out or refer clients to restoration companies?

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  5/9/2006 2:30:48 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 5/9/2006 4:05:34 PM
PR_ Adjuster

Member

Total Posts: 103
Last Post: 4/29/2010
Member Since: 3/13/2006

As a general rule, I do not reccommend any contractors, although I do have contractors and engineers ready to do the work.  The reasoning behind this is that the Insured or the Claimant will interpret that the work will be guarranteed by either me, the Insurance Company, or both.  Also, any damages that the contractor may cause to the Insured, Claimant or others may be claimed against me or the company, so generally speaking, I do not reccomend anyone.

In certain cases I have written up a general release of liability for damages and  third party claims favoring me and the company, and only then, I will bring in a contractor to do the jiob....

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  5/9/2006 4:05:34 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 5/9/2006 5:47:16 PM
ebrooks

Member

Total Posts: 145
Last Post: 11/5/2007
Member Since: 3/18/2006

PR,

If you gave the insured the names of three licensed contractors, do you think you'd be held responsible for the work of the one the insured chose?

Have you or your principal actually been held responsible for a contractor's work on a theory of negligent referral? Or agency?
 
I never was.
 
EB

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  5/9/2006 5:47:16 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 5/9/2006 5:53:23 PM
PR_ Adjuster

Member

Total Posts: 103
Last Post: 4/29/2010
Member Since: 3/13/2006

EB
 
On your first question, I really do not think I would be found responsible, but I'd rather avoid the defense costs!
 
On your second question, never.  However, due to the current state of litigation and sometimes absurd judgements, I would think it's just a matter of time...

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  5/9/2006 5:53:23 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 7/1/2006 11:12:31 PM
Dimechimes

Member

Total Posts: 17
Last Post: 4/2/2009
Member Since: 7/1/2006

Most carriers are requiring a minimum of three contractors names be provided to an insured-IF THEY ALLOW IT AT ALL- these days. In the majority of cases, this only applies also to contractors on a carriers list of preferred contractors.

This is becoming a big issue in cases. I have recently spent some time speaking with an Indp firm owner who followed the carrier's guideline on this and his adjuster gave out 3 names. The IA firm has been tied up in litigation on this now for 2 years as the contractor handling this large commercial loss. He advised his own defense costs have been over 40K. His E and O carrier had to get involved and it's been a true nightmare for his firm. They gave out the name, even had it is writing in the letter that they did not guarantee workmanship,etc. The contractor somehow got the insured, a sub, and the mtg co to endorse a multi million dollar check to him then took off with the funds and is no where to be found although many firms,etc looking for him.
 
As a prior claim manager, I have also been involved in management of cases where the their was poor workmanship by the contractor recommended as 1 of 3 given.
 
Having said all of this, my preferences is not to refer contractors and seems to be the trend of many carriers especially on cat losses today.
 

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Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  7/1/2006 11:12:31 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 7/6/2006 1:22:21 PM
MrayA

Member

Total Posts: 9
Last Post: 1/3/2009
Member Since: 6/9/2006

Dimechimes,

  I read your anecdote and can only respond that in 25 years of adjusting, I have never heard a similar story. Thankfully! I believe this story represents the true practice of "shotgunning" legal  tactics, with the attorneys trying to find deep pockets to make up for the absconded funds. I would be genuinely interested in the suit outcome and cringe thinking how E&O costs could soar. 
  I have always kept a short list of reputable contractors who will provide me "second opinion" or do the job for the estimated amount in the event an insured couldn't find a contractor willing to undertake the repairs at the estimated price. Occasionly, they convince me my estimate is wrong, short, under scoped or even less often, over priced or scope. This actually did happen as the contractor found a way using new technology to provide what the insured wanted that cost less than the exact replacement. A competent, ethical contractor is gold to the adjustment process and is as necessary to the process as the adjuster. Unless the adjuster is intending to do the work, the ethical contractor will respond when and how instructed with the tools necessary and none of my  insured's has ever balked or sued when the job was done right and on(in) time.
 

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  7/6/2006 1:22:21 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 7/6/2006 8:43:06 PM
ebrooks

Member

Total Posts: 145
Last Post: 11/5/2007
Member Since: 3/18/2006

So the safe thing to do is don't mention any contractor. How do you adjust a property loss without mentioning a contractor?

Normally it involves getting an "agreed cost." That means with a contractor 99% of the time. Who chooses this contractor?

If you want to keep at arms length through the whole process, the only way I can think of is to:

1. Hand your estimate to the insured and say "Here is what I think it will cost, it is your decision to choose whoever you like to do the work."

2. Or the insured has a contractor there to meet you. You then negotiate an agreed cost with him, and have the insured sign off on it.

The fact is, insureds can become extremely dense when it is in their interest to do so. When you hand this insured an estimate his first question will be "Who will do it for this price?"

Then, since it is apparently a bad idea to give three names, you say "There is the phone book. You find one." Oh, really? The agent will be on the line complaining in a flash (as soon as the insured calls him to say how he's being treated by you).

In the insured contractor scenario, the problem is, many contractors get with the insured and massage the adjustment, work up the costs, and generally make things difficult for you, by inflating the scope/price so that your principal will not pay it or you will look like a sap/incompetent/in bed with the insured/contractor if you recommend paying it.

The insured is of course usually complicit in this, so that his complaints  to the carrier about your unfeeling difficult unfair adjusting are hypocritical to say the least.

What then?

Appraisal, of course.

The bottom line to this is, is your company/principal ready to go to appraisal whenever necessary to maintain the arms length distance and the integrity of the claims process? I don't think so.

So how do you avoid bringing in your contractor and/or recommending contractors?

The truth is you as an IA will be left to swing in the wind with your E & O carrier. Your principal will have no compunctions about squeezing you and your E & O carrier for everything it can get in the ensuing litigation.

The integrity of the claims process means the carrier stands behind the adjuster when he stands up for the integrity of the claims process. Does the carrier support the adjuster when the stuff starts to fly? When the insured complains to the agent? When the agent complains to the carrier?

I’d actually not sure how often the carrier supports the adjuster. As the adjuster, you don’t tend to hear about what is going on in the background complaint-wise–although sometimes of course you hear quite a bit.

Any comments?

View Revisions : 1   |    Posted:  7/6/2006 8:43:06 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 12/14/2006 9:06:23 PM
cjf1160

Member

Total Posts: 5
Last Post: 12/14/2006
Member Since: 8/30/2006

our company has contracts with restoration companies these days...We use service master exclusively.Times keep changing..we use to  work with different companies...not anymore

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  12/14/2006 9:06:23 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 12/17/2006 8:20:01 AM
William S Cook

Member

Total Posts: 68
Last Post: 10/18/2014
Member Since: 11/1/2006

Remember

The policy provides that it is the insured's responsibility to present the loss to insurers, not the insurers responsibility to present the loss to the insured.  Most damage estimates are provided as a courtesy to the insured to expedite the claims process.  Most policies provide that insurers can take over the claim and make repairs.  That creates a new contract between the insurer and the insured  and waives the terms of the policy.  Just my thoughts and looking to learn from others.
William S Cook
Florida Public Adjuster

William S Cook Public Adjuster Licensed PA in several states

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  12/17/2006 8:20:01 AM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post
P: 4/28/2007 2:03:26 PM
marissacae

Member

Total Posts: 5
Last Post: 4/28/2007
Member Since: 4/26/2007

The players in our area are Servpro and Service Master.  I see them as the same.  it is my understanding that the gentleman who started Servpro was with Service Master.  Can I view these two as competition for my non franchise restoration company.  Benefit?  Detriments?

Revisions : 0   |    Posted:  4/28/2007 2:03:26 PM    |    IP:  Recorded    |    Report this post

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